HyperGrow and HyperGerm: Using Biologicals for Drought Tolerance and Soil Health

0:00 Welcome everybody to our fifth webinar of this biological webinar series. Again want to go through a little housekeeping rules. Everybody is muted. If you have questions you can type them in the Q&A box and we'll try to get as many of them answered at the end of the presentation as we can.

0:22 We're going to go a little bit different route today. We've got Austin Cisneros with Elevate AG. He is the product production manager for Elevate AG. So he does a little bit of everything for Elevate AG from making the product to selling it to traveling all over to visit with guys to help them apply it to their farms.

0:47 Prior to that he was an elementary school teacher and after COVID the remote teaching he just wanted to find something that was going to feel more helpful. So with his background in cattle and how he enjoys the microbiome, the gut microbiome and figuring that out with cattle, he just thought the soil health part was a perfect fit.

1:12 Austin and Scott Shimer from Cheyenne Wells, Colorado. He is a farmer down there, a row crop farmer down in Cheyenne Wells. Uses some Elevate AG products. He's also one of the former dealers down in that area. So Austin and Scott are going to have kind of a little conversation and kind of go over what Scott is seeing in a very dry, I would say almost desert-like area in that part of the world. So I'll let you guys take it away.

1:46 One more thing before you guys start. Austin's sharing his screen. His video is not working, so that's kind of why you're not going to see Austin today, just a little heads up.

2:04 I'll kick it off. I got introduced to Elevate AG about three, four years ago now with Travis Craft and we were always trying to look for a new way to improve our soil health. We're in a really tough area and like I've said and touted to Austin, it's become the Hyper Grow product has been the staple in our fertility program and the reason we're using it is just trying to create soil health beyond just our regular fertilizers.

2:36 We definitely had some tremendous success. Like Dylan says, we are in a super dry region and even last year I had our crops wrote off and we did not think during wheat harvest that we would harvest a single acre of our spring crops, corn or milo, and we ended up cutting every acre. It wasn't dynamic but I really attribute a lot of it to the practices and the product that we're using.

3:06 So Scott's kind of talked to us about some things that you're seeing as far as what type of growth, what are some of the benefits that you're seeing with plant health?

3:20 Visual wise, you know, we get through the heat of the day and of course out here we can get with our transpiration and our sandy soils, you know, we can get to 105 degrees and that old corn even at 10 A.M. starts curling up on the neighbors and we've shared some photos with Austin and with the Elevate AG our corn even in the middle of the day was still laying out flat and just healthy soil was it. It was really proving a healthy plant where we really saw it too was when we get that morning mist, you know, maybe it's just enough to get your windshield wet. Our corn is really thriving on that where everything else around that wasn't treated with the product was not. It was your typical looking like pineapple and especially on the corn end and we've seen that for the last three years and we started with trial plots and now it's just now we use Hyper Grow as just a staple part of our product.

4:22 Yeah, so kind of bouncing off of what Scott said is again, I apologize for my video. Believe it or not, I was a remote teacher for a year so you would think I'd be an expert at Zoom but appears to be otherwise. I've really enjoyed working with Scott and his story, just kind of hearing talk about. He's a really passionate guy as you can tell and he is definitely a think outside the box sort of guy, whether it's shrimp farming or all the adventures that he gets into.

4:57 To Scott about a couple different things and he's always right there to say yeah, let's try it, whatever. Let's so he's willing to jump on board right away. So I appreciate that. He's fun to work with.

5:07 So what kind of Scott is, you know, the benefits we're getting out of HyperGrow are working with that biology and getting just like you said, just a little bit of moisture, you know, just that would show up on the windshield with working on this, you know, four years of using HyperGrow, continuing to build on that biology, that's those microbes in there working for you and continuing to cycle just that little bit of moisture. Even, you know, as dry as it is out there, if you can just get a little bit of dew or any moisture, they're just like you and I, you know, take a drink of water and it goes a lot further when you have healthier soil. You're able to retain more moisture and just kind of keep those that biology primed up so that as your plant gets stressed from, you know, the elements of Mother Nature, you are kind of able to get to that little bit, you know, get a little further help, make some management decisions and just kind of keep a little bit of power in your hand, you know, to get to that next trainer to help with those management decisions.

6:08 You know, it's great that to hear you say, you know, you were able to harvest every acre and so you're seeing the benefits in it.

6:15 We kind of talked a little bit about some of our other products as far as HyperCycle goes and the importance of, you know, kind of looking at that for the fall as how we can kind of get another harvest out of that residue and we're able to pull those nutrients down and really build a nice biome for that incoming seed in the spring and just the importance of just trying to build this soil health up so that we're able to, you know, want promote a healthy environment for the seed coming in but just get the most out of our ground and try to, you know, make a healthier product at the end of the day and try to, you know, help with the ROI, which is what truly I enjoy the most is just kind of getting these guys to make these changes and walk along these journeys and I guess that's what I really enjoy about working with Elevate AG.

7:13 Yeah, it's what we do too is a, you know, the bottom line is everything you even have it up here: profitable farming. That's kind of staple of my operation and the program I develop, Simple Farms, is to track all that. But we've the last few years have just shifted our input dollars of our fertility and years ago I been going to these no-till conferences, regenerative ag, trying to find a way to make this really work for our operation. Every one of us is different and the decision I made was all right, we're going to adopt some of these new products, the HyperGrow, some of these other biologicals and the way we're going to do is we're just going to shift our fertility dollars. We already know we're going to spend so much on 10-34-0, 32-0, so let's just shift these dollars into these new products and not, we're not trying to replace anything. We're just supplementing and these last couple years, as dry as we've been, we still stick with our biologicals and put our soil to work and that's what I was hearing early on in these conferences is hey, you guys, we're working so hard pushing our fertilizers instead of just really letting this soil go back to work for us and utilize what you're seeing tied up out there and the Elevate AG products are exactly that direction. That's what you guys are looking at and that's the HyperCycle like Austin brought up is something we really want to introduce is getting it where it's breaking down some of this heavier residue. We're feeling quite fortunate that we're going to have some fields this year that maybe we got more residue than we can manage with our equipment so if we can break it down with biologicals and put that right back in the soil to work for us and still be able to get through with the planting equipment we have, I'm really excited to use it that way and just get away from all these other mechanical tools that we've had to use historically to get us a stand.

9:09 Did you Scott, did you mention that you're using HyperGrow in furrows? That, wait, did you tell the process of that? Yeah, yeah, so all our equipment for years has been set up with liquid.

9:21 Even my air drill, I've designed my own systems. For years we've put liquid in furrow with our planter. We put all our liquid in-furrow, so we're trying to get it there with the plant. Now if we feel like things are looking really good, we're talking about this year with our wheat. A couple weeks here we'll be out top dressing, looking to put Hyperdraw on top as well and probably some of this fish fuel to really accelerate the biology.

9:50 The in-furrow is so important. I mean, foliar is great, and obviously at Elevate AG we just want to work with the producer where they're at with the things that they're implementing. If we can get it there in-furrow and build and get that seed started right, kind of stealing off David Olson from last week because he always had a healthy seed is a healthy plant. That's extremely beneficial to keep all that biology right there, get it in the soil. So when that seed, that future, that's our dollars in the field, and create as good of an environment for that as we can and really get that plant promoted from the get-go. And with helping with all the benefits with drought stress and pests and weeds and all these things, it's really neat when we get to get this soil working for us or for the producers. The different things that you see outside of what you're truly after, your goal, and that's kind of something you and I have had that conversation a couple times, Scott, is just kind of weeds and the pests that you've seen the benefit or the difference in since using product.

11:16 With the kite in, that plant, you know, I guess it's hard to grasp as a farmer. We're doing a lot of things, we're wearing a lot of different hats, and the science that's coming out with the biologicals and all the plant health, there's a lot wrapping our minds around and learning about. I'm always learning and finding where that initial treatment by the seed and the plant carries that all the way through its life and creates that protection, almost that immune system like you and I have. Yes, it makes sense now, but you don't think about all that at that point.

11:54 One thing we did see even in this high stress here as well, we didn't raise great crops but we still had great quality. I think that was another huge dynamic. I can remember historically if we had a four-year moisture-wise and everything, we just didn't have very good quality grain either, whether it was the wheat, the milo test weights, or anything. But this year even our corn, we had fields that only yielded in the teens, we went ahead and picked them, but we're still shipping 59 pound test weight corn. We didn't get below 57 pound test weight corn in super extreme drought conditions. I think that translates a lot to this biological all the way to the end result of your grain.

12:45 So what's kind of been some of your key takeaways since implementing these biologicals? What would you tell guys going forth, what's some advice that you have for some of these guys, Scott?

12:58 I think the key one is communication with you guys. We find ourselves kind of blowing and going when it's planting time. Everything kind of goes out the window. You guys might have told us not to mix this with that. I think it's important with everybody out there to definitely communicate with your supplier, the provider of the products. Elevate AG is excellent about communicating back. Be careful what you mix these products with. They will cause problems if you introduce them with the wrong other products. Mix it in a jug or in a bucket before you introduce it all together because there are problems when you're putting the biologicals together with certain synthetics and other products. They don't all get along. They all look like liquid to begin with, but boy can they make a mess. We've definitely had our experiences here where we mixed some products and really had a mess. I think it's important for everybody to communicate.

13:56 And just really lay out a game plan how they're going to mix this product and what they're going to use before they introduce it when it's blow and go time and you're all slugged up, that's not much fun.

14:07 Yeah, I agree. When we really strive to keep that constant communication, so when we're working with producers, the more information you can give us, the better it's going to be and the faster we can make a plan. You know, it's like Scott said, we're working with living biology. So not only are these microbes cycling water and carbon and nitrogen and freeing up these nutrients for us, you know, increasing the photosynthesis, but it's we're working with living things. So we kind of got to keep that in mind and know that when we put these microbes in and give them a food source, you know, that they're going to go to work. So we want to make sure that we get them to work in the soil where we want them and not in a tank setting or something like that. So we try to be very conscious of that and we've tried to get all of our ducks in a row as far as that goes, but these are, it's what makes it fun, I guess, in a sense. But you also kind of need to be aware of it.

15:16 We've created some science projects. Jim that's with me, he's cyber, we call them our Sir Mix-A-Lot, and we pulled a shuttle out that was molasses, thought it had it pretty rinsed, and he added the hyper growth to it and we had a volcano in no time. He had to run home and change.

15:48 So let's see what else have we discussed. Oh, weeds. We've had some interesting conversations, that's been a book, they've been cracking into and talking quite a bit about. It's the importance of how what those, you know, I'm sure everybody's heard it before, that weeds aren't, you know, they're a good sign, a good indicator of what's going on in the soil. And I was telling Scott a couple weeks ago about how I been driving down the road and I look out in fields and I'm like, oh, I know what's there, you know what's in the soil. So we kind of went down a rabbit hole on that.

16:25 All right, that's what makes it fun, I guess. That's what I enjoy about this, you know. You look at things a little differently, I guess. So you start to really dive into this and you know, for lack of a better term, you kind of really get down into the dirt a little bit and it's what makes it fun.

16:48 That's no, I agree, Austin. The thing I catch myself all the time is as I try to be progressive, but I still catch myself locked in the box of this is how we've always done it. And it's I find it very important to go out and ask questions, everybody, just like you, and look at what our fields are doing and how can we make this better. We're fighting these weeds, is there a different route of carrying this problem? Soil health is a big one. Let's try to cure our problems with soil health instead of with more chemicals. And you've opened my eyes to that and that's definitely a process we're looking forward to trying this year is introducing more humic and other things to and cutting back on certain fertility structures to just have a healthy plant and prevent the weed pressure.

17:42 Yeah, I mean, as we continue down this road and like you were talking about earlier, the programs of implementing fish and feeding that fungal, and as we continue to increase that fungal population and get them to work, that it's less nutrients that are tied up and they're cycling. And that's what makes it where you don't have an excess of one nutrient or another to create that home for weeds. And it's really neat that as you get that, you know, continue to feed that, and we continue to turn that biology up into microbes and get that bacterial population in balance and get everybody kind of give them a job that they're able to use up those nutrients so that you help with the weed suppression and stuff. And so yeah, I mean, it all starts with healthy soil, like you've said, like, you know, we see it.

18:31 Hey Oscar we got a question out there from Jim. He's asking about the soil temperature. What's your answer on that as far as making a difference with applying these products?

18:42 Soil temp, I mean we'd like to see, just that plant I guess what our ground's telling us. If the plant starts to photosynthesize and it starts to warm that ground up then we can go out and start to pull those samples. The biggest thing is just staying consistent with when you do it. If you pull it in the fall your first year make sure that you continue to pull it in the fall so that you can see, or in the spring or whenever it is, just stay consistent with it so that when you're looking at things and the big scope of it, your data is consistent from the get-go.

19:19 And so whenever the soil starts to warm up and you're like okay, here's what I think is a good time, it's whatever's easiest for you and then we can kind of, just the biggest key is just keeping it consistent.

19:33 We've got another one here from Dennis. He's asking Austin, as the Hyper Grow change with the ingredients? He sees the main ingredient is it still the compost extract from Johnson Suite?

19:46 So the ingredients in Hyper Grow are the same. What it is, we've extracted from a highly fungal population and then we've added some worm castings. And as far as we're not extracting a Johnson Suite, we've gone through and pulled, kind of done the engineering on this and figured out what each one of these components are bringing for us and that's what we've added as our extract, which is a highly, highly fungal. And that's kind of what gets out there and gets that biology promoted. And then we've also got some trace minerals in there, some humic acids and stuff like that that we know are beneficial. And so we can get them and get that kind of going back to that info, for a full year, what's that plant going to need and how can we promote this through the fungal, taking the fungal with the home or food source and really get them so when they get in that environment that they're able to turn up and get to work.

20:40 Mark, you're asking, hyper grow with sugar like acenetos fa. The only sugar we've introduced it to was molasses and that did not work out well. Things really got excited there. So we've stopped doing that. I don't know about the three sugar with the fulvic acid. I think that's definitely an answer for Austin to throw out there.

21:07 So he's doing a sugar with a fulvic, is that what he's saying? Yeah, three sugar, a centeos fa with basically a three sugar with a fulvic.

21:18 Yeah, the sugars tend to be more of a bacterial food versus a fungal. You can use them, you know they're going to feed that microbe. It's just how long that food source is going to last and what you're getting out of it. I guess that's the thing I would look at. Fulvic is great for getting it into plant absorption, helping transport that and make it readily available and being a food source as well for microbes. But I would get nervous with molasses as well. It's got a place, it's just you gotta know where we're at and what we're going to mix it with.

22:02 But I would steer more towards a fish, like Pacific Grove Oceanic Hydraulics, say TNT high energy fish, just to get more bang for our buck out of that food. And those fish products are fungal food. So what are we trying to promote, a fungal population or a bacterial population? And so kind of that's how we look at that and then decide where we want to plug in this food source at. And that's kind of going to be our approach this year, so we're going to mix more of the fish product with the Hyper Grow. Sure, how that acts, yep.

22:43 Armin was thrown out there. The Hyper Grow, we've been using it with our milo the last few years and it's definitely helped our chlorosis issues on our milo. We haven't seen near the yellowing we did a little more of.

22:58 This last year only because we did not get any rain when we had that Milo, but once we got some rain it snapped out of it. But the years before when we've had a little moisture out there, really with our Milo we've got such a high pH calcification and a tied up iron. When we have that hyper grow in our Milo has really thrived with that.

23:24 Just you know, continue on that. As we continue to increase this fungal populations, we create such a healthy environment that these problems that we have aren't as great of a chance to come in and move. We've built too good of a home for them to come into and thrive. And so it starts with that fungi going, getting that biology going and getting it cycling. That helps eliminate all these issues that we have, whether it's rust or corrosion or whatever it is. These things they thrive on weakness. I guess, for lack of a better term, it's like a mountain lion doesn't pick the biggest bull elk on the hill on the mountain. He picks the older, the young, or something. And so I guess that's the same thing—it's biology. We're just talking in a different food web. And as we continue to create a better, healthier plant with a higher functioning soil, we're able to get rid of those predators. And so that's why we're able to eliminate some of these things.

24:34 The next question that I'll just tell my little story here with oryx acid. Do you have some comparison yields when using hypodrome compared to not using it? We really the selling point for us was three years ago. We tried one field with the hyper grow and another without. This ground has been in my family since the 50s. We have farmed it identical—it was just across the road from one another. And it was a super dry year. In fact, we had insurance come out and adjust the corn that was not treated, and the corn right across the road—everything was identical historically for years and years in every aspect: plant dates, population, seed types, all the other fertility. The only variable was hypergro, and we saw 32 bushel an acre yield difference, I believe is what it was. And we have photos of that. We shared that with Elevate AG. I think that's extreme—it's in an extreme environment—but we definitely saw that was a huge selling point to us. That's what it did. And obviously we've been so synthetic for years that the hyper grow was doing a lot of things for our soils, bringing out a lot that had been tied up for years, and really accelerated that in our growing crops. So yeah, we definitely have seen some yield increase results. Those aren't ones I would tell all the time, but for us in eastern carbs, it's a huge selling point.

26:02 And you know, it kind of going with your moving off of the synthetics is, you know, as we cut back or reduce, we're able to preserve more and more of that biology so it's there for us in the spring. And that's what leads to those things where you've got nutrients that have been broken down that are available because your microbes are able to survive and continue to work for you. Hyper germ is another one, you know, down southern part of the state guys using our hypoderm product, our seed treatment, and you know, kind of having great success as far as wheat suppression on soybeans, you know, three to five bushel increase on beans as well. So it's just kind of what you know, Scott, bouncing off what you're saying—it's just interesting when you get it in environments to see kind of the different benefits and things that different producers and farmers see.

26:53 A chip Colts firing out there was the cost of this product. I assume he's asking for the hyper growth cost. Okay, infero would be 10.50, and foliar would be 14 an acre. So 10.50 in-furrow and 14 an acre foliar. So you're talking about a gallon and a half an acre or two dollars, two dollars foliar, yep. And it's a good start, you know, and kind of off of what I said earlier is you know, let's send a food source with that so that we can get more bang for a buck out of our biology. They're just like you and I, you know—they need food to continue to work.

27:36 They can't work on any empty stomach as well. Mark's asking out there, can you mix Hypergerm with Amplify L for a seed treatment on corn or wheat? I'm not familiar with Amplify L. Sorry Mark, maybe we can find that out.

28:03 Ken Overcast asking, have you had any experience with anionic soil amending agents to help with tight soils? Is there any negative consequences for the biology?

28:18 If we mix our biology with any products with any form of synthetic, it's we want to be the last thing in the tank to go. So this is living biology. As it sets in, we're not going to destroy all of it, but we're able to crank our populations up so high that we do lose some, but there's still such a high population out there that you're still getting benefits. It's just get it in the tank and get that biology to work for you. It's not doing any good sitting in a tank, so we want to get it out and get it in the ground.

28:57 As far as Hypergerm and the Amplify L, we haven't had any issues. I would want to see a tag or something and just talk to the producer more about that so I know what's going on. We can kind of get in front of ourselves that there is going to be an issue.

29:20 Jim's asking, have you tried detox the soil before applying the products? I have not. I don't even know the process. That's an interesting question. I'm not familiar with it either.

29:40 Roger asks, fish hydrolysate with the Hypergrow in the same tank? We did it. Yeah, we did it this year doing our ride and had no problem mixing the two together in our tank. We carry saddle tanks on our drills and so we had over a thousand gallons of it mixed together and drilled the whole section and didn't have a problem doing that.

30:09 When you call and talk about products, we need nozzle sizes, filters, all of those sorts of things. A tighter mesh filter is doing exactly what you put it on your equipment for, to filter more things out. Sometimes it will cause issues, but we just need to talk through those things. Armin was actually here doing it with us so we had the guru here helping us. He was going to be the one wearing it if we had an issue.

30:47 Dennis is asking, speak to what products originate with David Olson's Sustainable Solutions and what products are from other sources or cultured in a lab. We work very closely with David Olson. As far as our products go, we've been able to on a large scale build our resources using our resources the best that we can so that we're able to get product out for ourselves as well as David. It's all cultured in a lab. It's all living biology and we just crank that population up so high and continue to feed them so that we can have those high populations. So there is no cultured lab. It's extraction from fungal and we just continue to crank them and feed them up and make them extremely high in fungal or extremely high in bacterial wherever our situations are. So yeah, I guess that answers it.

32:12 Matt says, have you checked Brix levels on your crops as you have continued to use the product to see if it has brought up plant sugars? We haven't checked Brix levels on my end. What we do do is we use the Brain Says device and we're tracking what we've seen is the protein levels in the corn has been up in the 16. I think that translates a little bit to that aspect and our test weights have—

37:20 We have a dry seed treatment. Jim's asking for someone that has never used any biology in an area that only gets around 17 inches of rainfall per year, what would you start with? Jim, we're over here for Cheyenne Wells. I'm at 12 inch annual. I don't think we've seen that since 2017. Last year I think we were five inches of rain total.

37:51 The hyper grows been my first go-to and we've just kind of shifted about a third of our inputs over to the hyper grow and take mix that in to get things started. That was kind of our beginning. We're super dry here and it just blows my mind that we're able to harvest anything with that limited rainfall, but that's definitely accelerated because our ground's been waiting so long to go to work for us.

38:43 The next one keeps asking, can you recommend a good Brix reader device? I just got on Amazon and type in refractometer. There's all sorts of options. Mine's in a light blue plastic case. So as far as a brand goes, if they type in refractometer on Amazon, they'll pop right up.

39:16 Norm, do you have any opinion about whether the biology is on some level driving the plant to increase photosynthesis to increase root exudates? Absolutely, yep. That is exactly what we're after. That's exactly what's happening out there. You nailed it.

39:38 Clint, Austin, can you repeat the name of the book that tells what weeds tell us about soil deficiencies? It's 'When We Talk' by Jay McCammon. It doesn't look fancy by any means, but it's just a good starting piece. It's a good educational piece. It makes you think a little bit and look at things differently.

40:32 It's called 'When Weeds Talk' by J L McCammon. Then Galen asks, please give price and use of seed treatments. The rate would be six to eight ounces per 100 pounds of seed. You need to know your planting population and what your seed bag weighs to figure that out. That is sixty dollars a gallon, but just six to eight ounces per acre, so it depends on planting populations.

41:16 Williams says make sure the refractometer is not the HVAC type. I was talking to a producer and they said they use it like for chicken antifreeze or something. There are different sources, maybe that's what he was talking about. Yeah, get the proper device. You can test coffee, your soda, any of that stuff. There are so many different uses to it.

41:52 I recommend carrying a pair of vice grips or pliers. Sometimes that tends to help to get some of that sugars out of there. You don't need very much, just a drop, but sometimes it can be a little difficult to get some out of a plant. Scott in Austin also shared a link on Amazon for 'When Weeds Talk' and the refractometer.

42:30 That's the end of the questions at this point. William just fired out their fruit juice testing type on the refractometer there. Dennis asks, to use hypercrow instead of water for mixing inoculants, is it okay to use it that way?

42:54 I would recommend the hypergerm just because of the you're getting so many more of the benefits for that seed and just helping stick around that coat or sticking to the code of the you know coating that seed. I guess if I understand that question right, and then Matt's asking something similar: can we apply hypergrow as a seed inoculate? What results might we observe applying inoculation versus in burrow? For me, you know, we're talking a volume of a gallon and a half per acre. For me, I don't think I'd want to put it on the seat and get it caked up in the tank, but Austin, I guess I'll leave that to you.

43:35 Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say is you know Armin went through these and figured out, you know, the product in the application. And so it's for the benefits that you're getting in different, you know, each product they're bringing something different. And that's why, you know, I — if you're wanting to see treatment, it's a great start. And then to come, you know, anytime we can bring biology into things, we're just ramping everything up, introducing a new, you know, introducing that fungal and getting that, you know, feeding on the indigenous species that are out there and kind of turning everything up and getting building, diversifying our biology. And so I would highly recommend a seed treatment as, you know, it's six to eight ounces, so it's not much to it versus, you know, you're getting a gallon and a half of product an acre into that furrow for that more availability, more nutrients for that plant.

44:32 Yeah, so you're kind of throwing out to Matt there: use hypergerm if he's wanting to treat a seed, is that correct? Correct, yeah, okay. And then Clint, can you talk about metagro, Austin? How is it different from hypergrow?

44:48 The fungal population, just the higher fungal population. Would you say with our hypergrow, we talked about the chitins, is that a difference? Well, yeah, hypergrow has a lot of nutrients with it — just whether it be a trace mineral, you know, seaweed, humic, chitosan, all of these other nutrients that we've added into it, which is what makes it such a great product in furrow is all the other benefits that come with it.

45:25 Yeah, plant, we saw with the hypergrow, we've been especially in these dry periods really fighting the grasshoppers on the perimeters, and that chitin is what's breaking down that exoskeleton mandible and it's really cut them back. They're not putting near the pressure on us. And we did have an incident down here with one of our fields where we had the soft light, and we started treating all that area with the hypergrow with the chitosan, and I know that shut those guys down as well. And we didn't have the problem this last year even with the stressed wheat, so I think that's a big one we really enjoy with the hypergrow is the chitin and it translating that into the plant for its own defense against these insects. And then, you know, the aphids, they're going to jump onto the neighbors that aren't treating for that and leave us alone.

46:16 Yeah, and hypergrow has metagro F in it, so you're getting that, that's what's making that high fungal population. But yeah, like you're saying, Scott, is just it's all these benefits that come to it, and as that plant's able to cycle it around, cycle through it.

46:34 Okay, I see here James asked: is it better to put your seed treatment on untreated seed versus putting it on seed that comes with several fungicides and insecticides on it?

46:48 Yes, it's we are bringing high fungal populations and that's the con — the biology has to work through those different coatings. Then, you know, when it's, you're just, it's that much longer for it to get into to see where you want it to be. So yeah, naked seed versus, you know, a seed that's been treated a couple times, we're just stretching that road for that biology to get to your seed off with those treatments versus the naked seed. It's able to get in there, get right into that seed and get going.

47:30 Most of the questions for now. I do have a couple maybe to wrap up here. One, Scott, for you: you know, with your corn through that drought, or you were harvesting some and maybe your neighbors weren't, you know, what was the buzz word or the talk about, maybe, you know, around town, you know, seeing.

47:52 That you were able to have a harvest in a dry year like that. You know, there wasn't a lot of conversation. We would have the dialogue from the neighbors, but guys would ask us what we're doing and then they don't believe it. You know, we go through that time period. Austin was just here yesterday. We had a group of our producers and we just keep telling our story and hopefully that we get through and some of these guys we got a few that are interested now.

48:25 You had a great turnout last night I thought. That things, it was good. You know, it's funny sometimes you get outside of our neighborhood and we can have a lot more open conversation than just locally, but trying to have that dialogue with all our neighbors and what we're doing different. And we're not all successes. I have tremendous failures and I'm always asking my neighbors what their successes are so trying to keep that dialogue open between the two of us, what we can learn from each other.

48:54 Looks like Dennis actually just popped in here with a question. You know, speak to the persistence in the soil of these products or the need to reapply every year. And I think that's going to vary from location to location based on a lot of environmental factors, but if you guys can maybe speak to that a little bit.

49:15 I think that this biology is constantly evolving and as it evolves your soil evolves. And so we can go with similar products, but at the end of the day we've got to know where our soil's at, what's going on in our soil, and then what are our plants telling us. And so it is just constant learning and evolving and moving target, and that's what makes it fun. It's hard to say hey, here's what we're going to do over and over because we want to continue to go. And if we're doing things right, we're going to continue to build that fungal population up. And so it just takes time and we just got to kind of continue to look at things and be observant of everything.

50:05 This last year was probably our example. We stayed persistent with our hyper grow treatment and we cut back on our synthetics. We were so dry we just didn't feel like we were going to push our yields anyway, so we stayed persistent with our biology and cut back on our synthetics. I don't think we're ever going to replace the synthetics. We're just trying to supplement. And so I guess I'm treating my synthetics as my variable and stay persistent with my biologicals at this point in time.

50:35 Dennis and I would probably add to that you know, in order to keep that biology going, a living root is key. And sometimes that's easier said than done. Scott, I believe you're not quite found that niche with the cover crop thing yet in your area, but you know, if you can find that opportunity, that certainly can go a long ways to keeping that biology going.

51:01 That is really our push. I mean, we are super dry area. We're doing a lot of rotations this year. We're working with green cover doing cereal rye, and we're hoping to integrate that more following either our corn or our milo. Throw some grazing aspects in it or maybe even harvest some of that other for the grain itself. My ultimate goal with our farm, even with this limited rainfall, is getting to zero fallow. I would rather be full production year every year and have no fallow acres. We're a ways off from that. We have tried the cover mixes. I think we jumped in kind of fast in it, and it hurt us because we went into a dry period, so we're going to taper in again. I think there's a place for us. We just got to find that niche and we're testing it as we move along.

51:54 You know, probably one more question I would have. You know, when it comes to trying to select what biological program to go with, where are you doing any Haney tests, PLFA, TDNS? And then Austin, what would you recommend to maybe get started with to try to make a plan to go down this path? So on my end, we did partner up with Locus AG, so we are doing their seat.

52:31 Treatment biologicals in conjunction with Hyper run, we haven't, we are not going away from the hyper grow elevated AG products. We're actually at the fish fuel this year, so we're just supplementing more. So we are working with Locusts and they are doing the Haney tests on us with that program for the carbon market, and we are waiting on the results right now. So they did Haney for last year, but I don't have the results yet, and it'll be the first round for years we had done the soil probe samples, set them off, and I got tired of seeing any values move for us for years, even in the no-till. So we quit it a long time ago. So now that Haney's gonna be the first for us this year, so stay tuned.

53:12 Dylan, what I recommend is, you know where we're at, but as a starting base, a Haney is great because it tells us what's available to that plant. A TND is a total nutrient digestion, and so how that tells us is what we're able to tap into, what our potential is. And so as we turn the biology up through the testing of a PLFA, they all kind of work with one another. But to start with, I would say a TND is a great one to have, and then absolutely a Haney and a TND needs to be pulled every couple years, it just depends on the producer. But a Haney I would do, you know, my rotations just so you can see that these things are becoming, because this biology, it's going to move these minerals and nutrients and make them more plant available, and ultimately that's what we're after.

54:09 Okay, yeah, that's good advice. Hopefully, you know, be able to get people started. With that, I would say Scott Austin, any closing thoughts, any closing advice to you know before we get off here?

54:26 I think the biggest thing, I guess my lifelong perspective in farming is when you look at a field and a crop and your rotations, you don't have very many years to find your success in each field. I really go out and I seek professionals that have a lot more understanding, perspective, and I keep my mind open, and we're trying new things all the time. We're doing them in small scales, and once we see success, we expand with it. But I just say to everybody, keep trying, keep trying new things. We don't have a lot of years to get it right, but I think if we keep moving forward and really lean on these guys like Austin with Elevate AG to help us out and get through our, listen to them, trust them, and I think it'll help you a lot in the future.

55:12 Good, thanks Scott. I would say, you know, just kind of echoing on that, is you know, I guess my teaching background is, you know, know your context, get some knowledge on these things, find, educate yourself so that you're able to have those questions that are thought provoking and that continue to keep you hungry and moving. And you know, you're able to build on this knowledge and gather an understanding of it, and that's what makes it fun. Is all of these, you know, little tools, and finding out, you know, weeds, and just there's so many things. And just, yeah, be open-minded and eager to learn and just stay active with it. Get started, and you know, we're not, it's don't start with all your acres. Don't pull the plug 100 percent on your synthetics. Like, these are steps. It's a journey. It's not something that we're gonna flip our finger, you know, snap our fingers, and tomorrow we're in a whole different world. It's a step. It's a journey. It takes processes and practices and principal changes and mindset.

56:19 I look forward to doing this for a long time. So yeah, you're right, Austin. I'm actually on my 32nd year of farming. I took it over for my granddad at the age of 19. It's still a heck of a journey, and I could never imagine trying to jump in all this at once. It's been that whole journey, and it takes a long time. But I think patience and perseverance will pay off.

56:46 Well, very good. Yeah, gentlemen, thank you for taking time out of your day to continue this biological webinar series. You know, you can certainly get in contact with Elevate AG for any of these products or any of us green cover sales reps. We'll be happy to help you along with that. Again, this will be recorded and posted on our YouTube page, so if you want to go back and re-watch it, there's opportunity there. Next week, same time, we're gonna have Laura Decker on, and she is going to be talking about how to use the microbiometer and its many uses. So thank you all for attending today, and everybody have a great day.

57:31 Thank you.

57:34 Thanks Dylan.